[L2Ork-dev] issues on rasbian 9/10

Fri Apr 9 12:31:07 EDT 2021

Hey Albert,

thanks for the advice! 

But as I already wrote, I already found a solution that works for me: purr-data 2.10.1 on stretch. 

I used the pre-build deb-package from github.com/agraef/purr-data in stretch and it works out of the box. The repository in stretch however has the same issues as that in buster. 

So (even though I understood only 1/4 of what you were writing) my question would be: What happened between 2.10.1 and 2.16? Could it be possible to just copy the ALSA-Backend from 2.10.1 to 2.16?

And: Where do you want the bug-report to go? Under Issues in Gitlab or via ML?

Best,
Marten

> l2ork-dev-request at disis.music.vt.edu hat am 09.04.2021 11:09 geschrieben:
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>    1. Re: issues on rasbian 9/10 (Albert Graef)
>    2. Re: issues on rasbian 9/10 (Albert Graef)
> 
> 
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> Message: 1
> Date: Fri, 9 Apr 2021 11:00:55 +0200
> From: Albert Graef <aggraef at gmail.com>
> To: "An open mailing list for a world-wide network of aspiring
> 	L2Orkists, L2Ork developers contributors, and supporters."
> 	<l2ork-dev at disis.music.vt.edu>
> Subject: Re: [L2Ork-dev] issues on rasbian 9/10
> Message-ID:
> 	<CA+rUic2Ske6fjmdvPT3Hctranz8x6y1=ga5M8izONny=Wt4wzQ at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
> 
> Ok, I gave that a try now, but unfortunately it didn't help much. :( The
> high-pitched noise is gone, so that's an improvement. But the ALSA backend
> still only gets a bunch of xruns and then gives up after printing "restart
> alsa output; alsa xrun recovery apparently failed" a couple of times in the
> terminal, logging "error: audio I/O stuck... closing audio" in the Pd
> console.
> 
> One thing I noticed in htop is that the nw.js gui spawns quite a few
> threads all running at a nice level of -7, while the engine itself runs at
> -9. In vanilla you just get the wish gui (a single thread) running at 20,
> while the engine runs at -7. So there are some clear differences between
> purr-data and vanilla even if the ALSA backend is exactly the same (in that
> special build of purr-data I just did). I'm not sure why we run the GUI at
> such a high priority; maybe that's part of the problem. Jonathan might be
> able to shed some light on this.
> 
> As I said before, all these issues go away if you just use an external
> sound card, so the dsp *is* part of the equation here. Such a device will
> also work with Jack just fine. Even one of those really cheap and small USB
> audio adapters that you can get on Amazon for a couple of bucks will do the
> trick (I have the one from UGREEN, but the one from Sabrent[1] is also
> available on amazon.com and should do the job as well).
> 
> [1] https://www.amazon.com/-/de/dp/B00IRVQ0F8
> 
> Sorry Marten, I wished I had better news for you. It would still be nice if
> you could submit a full bug report on this, so that we can document what we
> know about this bug and hopefully fix it some time. But for the time being
> my suggestion for you would be to just get one of those little USB audio
> thingies and call it a day. ;-)
> 
> Best,
> Albert
> 
> 
> On Fri, Apr 9, 2021 at 2:29 AM Albert Graef <aggraef at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> > Just a quick followup: Comparing the source of our s_audio_alsa.c with
> > that of vanilla I do see some substantial differences. In particular, it
> > seems that we never backported two of Miller's commits from way back then,
> > https://github.com/agraef/pure-data/commit/75819aad and
> > https://github.com/agraef/pure-data/commit/de2ba0f6. In particular, the
> > former has an entire chunk of sw parameter initializations which is
> > completely missing in our code.
> >
> > What I can do as a quick check is to pull the latest s_audio_alsa.c from
> > vanilla into my testing branch and do a test build on my OBS preview
> > channel so that we can try it out on the Pi. That way we'll lose Sam
> > Thurston's recent MR concerning the error checking code in the module, but
> > we can always pull that back in again later if needed (vanilla also has
> > some changes there, so Sam's fixes might not be needed any more).
> >
> > Stay tuned,
> > Albert
> >
> >
> >
> > On Fri, Apr 9, 2021 at 1:42 AM Albert Graef <aggraef at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >> Hi Marten,
> >>
> >> I have exactly the same issue on my Raspberry Pi4. Purr works mostly fine
> >> even with a cheap USB audio dongle, but not with the built-in soundcard of
> >> the Pi. Pd 0.49.0 straight from the Buster repo works fine. So clearly
> >> there's a bug lurking in our ALSA support somewhere or we're missing some
> >> bit in the backend which makes this work in vanilla.
> >>
> >> This was discussed on the ml before, and IIRC we've blamed it all on the
> >> poor dsp of the Pi. ;-) But this can't be true if it works just fine in
> >> vanilla. So we should try again to track this down. It would help if you
> >> could submit a bug report at
> >> https://git.purrdata.net/jwilkes/purr-data/-/issues, then I'll look into
> >> it asap.
> >>
> >> Thanks,
> >> Albert
> >>
> >>
> >> On Thu, Apr 8, 2021 at 4:58 PM Marten Seedorf <marten.seedorf at mailbox.org>
> >> wrote:
> >>
> >>> Hey everyone,
> >>>
> >>> working on a sound installation with purr-data on the raspberry pi I
> >>> encountered some issues that might be worth mentioning.
> >>>
> >>> I installed the recent rasperry pi os (~ raspbian 10 buster) on a
> >>> raspberry pi 3B and installed purr-data from Albert Gräfs repositories on
> >>> opensuse.org. The installation went smoothly, but the audio engine
> >>> (alsa) didn't work. All I got was a high pitched, distorted noise. I tried
> >>> to use jack, but strangely it wasn't able to communicate with the audio
> >>> hardware via alsa as well. So it seems that the issue is rather in the OS
> >>> than in Purr Data. But: PD Vanilla is working perfectly fine (directly with
> >>> alsa, without jack).
> >>>
> >>> I went back to Raspbian 9 Stretch and installed Purr-Data from the
> >>> latest pre-build deb.-package I could find (2.10.1). That worked great.
> >>>
> >>> I became curious and installed Purr-Data on stretch from the
> >>> opensuse-repositories (Raspbian 9) and encountered the same issues as in
> >>> buster.
> >>>
> >>> So in the end, I found a solution that works for me. Still I figure
> >>> there could be something wrong with the repositories.
> >>>
> >>> Best,
> >>> Marten
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> L2Ork-dev mailing list
> >>> L2Ork-dev at disis.music.vt.edu
> >>> https://disis.music.vt.edu/listinfo/l2ork-dev
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> Dr. Albert Gr"af
> >> Computer Music Research Group, JGU Mainz, Germany
> >> Email: aggraef at gmail.com, web: https://agraef.github.io/
> >>
> >
> >
> > --
> > Dr. Albert Gr"af
> > Computer Music Research Group, JGU Mainz, Germany
> > Email: aggraef at gmail.com, web: https://agraef.github.io/
> >
> 
> 
> -- 
> Dr. Albert Gr"af
> Computer Music Research Group, JGU Mainz, Germany
> Email: aggraef at gmail.com, web: https://agraef.github.io/
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> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 2
> Date: Fri, 9 Apr 2021 11:08:54 +0200
> From: Albert Graef <aggraef at gmail.com>
> To: "An open mailing list for a world-wide network of aspiring
> 	L2Orkists, L2Ork developers contributors, and supporters."
> 	<l2ork-dev at disis.music.vt.edu>
> Subject: Re: [L2Ork-dev] issues on rasbian 9/10
> Message-ID:
> 	<CA+rUic0jj17q7+eRia1t78V8rSHCHVetS75t6ufgvOhRLe7ctA at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
> 
> Here's the Raspbian 10 deb of my special build in case you want to give
> this a try yourself. (I'm rolling back the package on the OBS preview
> channel now, so I uploaded a copy of this package to my Google Drive.)
> 
> 
>  purr-data_2.16.0+git4809+6d74b30a-1_armhf.deb
> <https://drive.google.com/file/d/1Egjb2k_Q3Svbuv1d9irjv_-h-zv-FOKR/view?usp=drive_web>
> 
> On Fri, Apr 9, 2021 at 11:00 AM Albert Graef <aggraef at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> > Ok, I gave that a try now, but unfortunately it didn't help much. :( The
> > high-pitched noise is gone, so that's an improvement. But the ALSA backend
> > still only gets a bunch of xruns and then gives up after printing "restart
> > alsa output; alsa xrun recovery apparently failed" a couple of times in the
> > terminal, logging "error: audio I/O stuck... closing audio" in the Pd
> > console.
> >
> > One thing I noticed in htop is that the nw.js gui spawns quite a few
> > threads all running at a nice level of -7, while the engine itself runs at
> > -9. In vanilla you just get the wish gui (a single thread) running at 20,
> > while the engine runs at -7. So there are some clear differences between
> > purr-data and vanilla even if the ALSA backend is exactly the same (in that
> > special build of purr-data I just did). I'm not sure why we run the GUI at
> > such a high priority; maybe that's part of the problem. Jonathan might be
> > able to shed some light on this.
> >
> > As I said before, all these issues go away if you just use an external
> > sound card, so the dsp *is* part of the equation here. Such a device will
> > also work with Jack just fine. Even one of those really cheap and small USB
> > audio adapters that you can get on Amazon for a couple of bucks will do the
> > trick (I have the one from UGREEN, but the one from Sabrent[1] is also
> > available on amazon.com and should do the job as well).
> >
> > [1] https://www.amazon.com/-/de/dp/B00IRVQ0F8
> >
> > Sorry Marten, I wished I had better news for you. It would still be nice
> > if you could submit a full bug report on this, so that we can document what
> > we know about this bug and hopefully fix it some time. But for the time
> > being my suggestion for you would be to just get one of those little USB
> > audio thingies and call it a day. ;-)
> >
> > Best,
> > Albert
> >
> >
> > On Fri, Apr 9, 2021 at 2:29 AM Albert Graef <aggraef at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >> Just a quick followup: Comparing the source of our s_audio_alsa.c with
> >> that of vanilla I do see some substantial differences. In particular, it
> >> seems that we never backported two of Miller's commits from way back then,
> >> https://github.com/agraef/pure-data/commit/75819aad and
> >> https://github.com/agraef/pure-data/commit/de2ba0f6. In particular, the
> >> former has an entire chunk of sw parameter initializations which is
> >> completely missing in our code.
> >>
> >> What I can do as a quick check is to pull the latest s_audio_alsa.c from
> >> vanilla into my testing branch and do a test build on my OBS preview
> >> channel so that we can try it out on the Pi. That way we'll lose Sam
> >> Thurston's recent MR concerning the error checking code in the module, but
> >> we can always pull that back in again later if needed (vanilla also has
> >> some changes there, so Sam's fixes might not be needed any more).
> >>
> >> Stay tuned,
> >> Albert
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On Fri, Apr 9, 2021 at 1:42 AM Albert Graef <aggraef at gmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >>> Hi Marten,
> >>>
> >>> I have exactly the same issue on my Raspberry Pi4. Purr works mostly
> >>> fine even with a cheap USB audio dongle, but not with the built-in
> >>> soundcard of the Pi. Pd 0.49.0 straight from the Buster repo works fine. So
> >>> clearly there's a bug lurking in our ALSA support somewhere or we're
> >>> missing some bit in the backend which makes this work in vanilla.
> >>>
> >>> This was discussed on the ml before, and IIRC we've blamed it all on the
> >>> poor dsp of the Pi. ;-) But this can't be true if it works just fine in
> >>> vanilla. So we should try again to track this down. It would help if you
> >>> could submit a bug report at
> >>> https://git.purrdata.net/jwilkes/purr-data/-/issues, then I'll look
> >>> into it asap.
> >>>
> >>> Thanks,
> >>> Albert
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On Thu, Apr 8, 2021 at 4:58 PM Marten Seedorf <
> >>> marten.seedorf at mailbox.org> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> Hey everyone,
> >>>>
> >>>> working on a sound installation with purr-data on the raspberry pi I
> >>>> encountered some issues that might be worth mentioning.
> >>>>
> >>>> I installed the recent rasperry pi os (~ raspbian 10 buster) on a
> >>>> raspberry pi 3B and installed purr-data from Albert Gräfs repositories on
> >>>> opensuse.org. The installation went smoothly, but the audio engine
> >>>> (alsa) didn't work. All I got was a high pitched, distorted noise. I tried
> >>>> to use jack, but strangely it wasn't able to communicate with the audio
> >>>> hardware via alsa as well. So it seems that the issue is rather in the OS
> >>>> than in Purr Data. But: PD Vanilla is working perfectly fine (directly with
> >>>> alsa, without jack).
> >>>>
> >>>> I went back to Raspbian 9 Stretch and installed Purr-Data from the
> >>>> latest pre-build deb.-package I could find (2.10.1). That worked great.
> >>>>
> >>>> I became curious and installed Purr-Data on stretch from the
> >>>> opensuse-repositories (Raspbian 9) and encountered the same issues as in
> >>>> buster.
> >>>>
> >>>> So in the end, I found a solution that works for me. Still I figure
> >>>> there could be something wrong with the repositories.
> >>>>
> >>>> Best,
> >>>> Marten
> >>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>> L2Ork-dev mailing list
> >>>> L2Ork-dev at disis.music.vt.edu
> >>>> https://disis.music.vt.edu/listinfo/l2ork-dev
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> --
> >>> Dr. Albert Gr"af
> >>> Computer Music Research Group, JGU Mainz, Germany
> >>> Email: aggraef at gmail.com, web: https://agraef.github.io/
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> Dr. Albert Gr"af
> >> Computer Music Research Group, JGU Mainz, Germany
> >> Email: aggraef at gmail.com, web: https://agraef.github.io/
> >>
> >
> >
> > --
> > Dr. Albert Gr"af
> > Computer Music Research Group, JGU Mainz, Germany
> > Email: aggraef at gmail.com, web: https://agraef.github.io/
> >
> 
> 
> -- 
> Dr. Albert Gr"af
> Computer Music Research Group, JGU Mainz, Germany
> Email: aggraef at gmail.com, web: https://agraef.github.io/
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------------------------------- 
Marten Seedorf
klangkünstler / musikpädagoge / audiotechniker
MSc Audiokommunikation und -technologie 

www.martenseedorf.de 

Tel.: +49 (0)30 / 24378441 
 E-Mail: marten.seedorf at mailbox.org